Interview: Doyle Turner
Interview by: Andy Ellis, Writer @andysmileyjay
Edited by: Andrew Perrizo, Owner/Editor @PlaylistTC
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Doyle Turner draws you in without even trying to. That was my experience when I saw him perform live for the first time at the 318 Cafe in Excelsior, MN. And it’s not the attitude of “Hey, everyone put your eyes on me,” but more of “Hey, how’s it goin’”?
As I’ve learned more about him I realize that’s part of his educator demeanor. His music shares that same quality of wanting to bring people together, and help them not feel so alone. I was able to talk to him about his current album Sweet, Difficult Sounds, and found out a great deal about his process including a love of collaboration as you’ll read below.
The interview below has been edited for clarity.
Andy Ellis: “What inspired the album’s title?”
Doyle Turner: “I am a lover of language - not just the sounds, but also the rhythms. Sweet, Difficult Sounds has that cadence that feels right in my ear. Secondly, it is the title of a beautiful short story written by a Washington D.C. author I.M. Desta.
The story is about an immigrant from Africa who is learning English as her second language. She is a high school student who, although she understands and can speak some English, chooses to remain hidden rather than appear foolish in front of her new peers. Language becomes the hero of the story, as Cole, a student in her class, is able to connect with the main character by learning some of her native language and attempting to speak it. Language as the way to connect is exactly what songs and songwriting does!
Also, the process of recording and shaping sounds is often difficult and fraught with so many decisions and trying to attempt and land things that are difficult. It seemed like a perfect metaphor for the songs on this album and the process of recording.”
A.E.: “When you look at these songs, do you see any themes that tie them together that you didn’t see before?”
D.T.: “I think that these songs speak about themes of the heart. I find that if I’m writing something that is important to me, there is someone out there for whom these things resonate, because as humans, we’re basically all the same. The Dahli Llama says that a lot.
These songs come from a place of emotion and feeling. There are different situations in each song, but they, all of these songs, speak about matters of the heart. ‘One Good Night’ is a song that is about wishing for that desire to connect with listeners while performing. ‘Half Past Noon’ seeks to describe that feeling of being in love over a long period of time and throughout many of life’s inevitable changes.”
A.E.: “This record was produced by Ted Hajnasiewicz. How did you know he was the right person to bring these songs to life?”
D.T.: “I met Ted through the Singer/Songwriter Songwriting Challenge Facebook group that Laurel Tomandl started. I joined in January of 2020, and in the summer of 2020, Ted asked if I’d do a co-write with him. Something immediately clicked when I started working with Ted.
In the summer of 2021, he invited me to do a gig with him, and we both felt a magic happen when performing together. It flowed so naturally, and felt like it was effortless to collaborate with him. We started writing more and more together, and found that it was a good collaboration and we were happy with the songs that we were getting from working with one another.
Ted also has been one of my biggest cheerleaders. He has done so much to help me along this singer/songwriter road. I have learned a ton from his experience, and have benefitted from his ongoing encouragement and support. Ted would be the last one to tell you this, but he has this super power where he can immediately hear production ideas for songs. Often in the midst of co-writing with him, he stops and this genius gear just kicks in and he describes what he hears for instrumentation, song structure, ways to add interesting contrast, or which voice should sing which part. It is stunning and impressive to watch.
As I began to gather these songs in the fall of 2021, I found myself consulting Ted more and more. Truth be told, I sensed strongly that Ted was about to offer to produce the album. Our conversations always seem to lead right up to that edge. I talked it over with my wife Molly, and then I asked Ted if he would consider it. He said yes, and we got to work.
Sweet, Difficult Sounds is my third solo album, and I’ve never seen my audio engineer and friend Troy Foss, who owns Supple Studios in Bemidji, MN, so excited as he was from the moment we began tracking with Ted the first day. Ted brings that kind of energy, magic, and skill to the recording studio and planning process. He has also been so prolific in the past five or six years, that he has developed this network of artists that he’s had work on his albums.
He brought that network to bear on Sweet, Difficult Sounds, and I feel as though this album has a unique collaborative sound that none of my other albums have had. He was the right person at the right time for this project and for me. Ted is my best friend. He taught me so very much and made this album amazing. We start tracking on our next album in a few weeks, and I cannot wait for the next result of our collaboration!”
A.E.: On “These Days” you end almost every line with that phrase, almost as if the song was more you just pondering out loud. What idea were you trying to explore with this song?
D.T.: “That song came as a prompt from the songwriting group. I remember struggling mightily with whatever the prompt was for that week. I put in all this time and was not pleased with what was coming. I remember joking in the video that I posted to the group that, ‘Doyle apparently forgot how to write a song until Thursday!’
On Thursday I happened to catch an interview with singer-songwriter Michael Franti in which he was talking about all these tours, plans, and backup plans that were disrupted by the pandemic. He had a resort somewhere on an island that was supposed to be his backup plan, and there he was living in this empty resort as travel was shut down. As he was explaining this, he stopped and said, “these days,” as a throwaway comment about the pandemic and its effects. I grasped on to that way he made that comment, the disgust and disbelief inherent in his tone, and wrote my pandemic song.
In my songwriting journey, I was exploring the power of repetition, and using this phrase at the end of these lines seemed to make it more contemplative. It seemed to keep bringing the situation to the forefront with that “I can’t believe this” type of undertone.
That song also came from someone whom I worked with who is the most wonderful person, but who did and said the strangest and harshest things that were hard for me to understand because of the political ideaology they were subscribing to at the time. There was a severe lack of compassion from a person who has nothing but compassion in their heart. ‘Are you enemy or friend, tell me once again?’ seemed the best way to get at that relationship that was twisted by the circumstances of the pandemic and the political situation of that time.
A.E.: “How did you choose which collaborators would work for which song?”
D.T.: “A musician friend of mine, Lance Benson, says, ‘The answer is always ‘no’ until you ask.’ Ted subscribes to that philosophy, so we shot for the stars, and we caught them! Steve Peffer, who is the band leader for the country group Alabama, was not touring because of the pandemic. Ted has worked with him previously, and so Steve jumped right in on everything that we sent him. We were fortunate that he had the time, and we were fortunate that the internet allowed us to work in this way.
Steve would send us this amazing keyboard work, and I would take the file and drop it into the latest mix in my DAW at home, and I remember my wife Molly and I listening to this audio goodness synced up to these songs I had written, and just being thrilled, amazed, and moved beyond belief. That was magic, and we owe it all to Steve.
Sarah Morris is my songwriting hero. Her songwriting is what led me to the Singer/Songwriter Songwriting Challenge. ‘In This Meantime’ is a song that was written in November of 2021, and when she heard it in the challenge, she commented that she heard harmonies on it. ‘One More Kiss Goodbye’ was throughout the planning and recording process, a song that Ted and I heard Sarah’s harmonies on. We originally approached her about doing those two songs, and because Sarah is one of the kindest and most generous humans to walk the earth, she agreed to do harmonies on the other four songs upon which she appears.
‘In This Meantime’ was my latecomer to the album, and it felt like the underdog throughout the entire process, right up to our deadline to go to master. Sarah Morris served up these outstanding harmonies for that song to my lead vocal track that I ended up re-tracking. I loved what she had done, but was not pleased with my vocal performance. I found the right adjustment very late in the timeline, and Sarah re-tracked her harmonies from her big green bathroom, and did these harmonies that were even more incredible. She improves ANY song that she sings on.
Mary Cutrufello was someone who we thought was the biggest longshot, and she agreed to play on the track, ‘One Good Night!’ That solo work has such a classic Mary Cutrufello Telecaster sound! I still turn that solo up each time it comes around when I listen. Both Ted and I hope to collaborate more with her in the future. I have gotten the opportunity to hear Mary twice over the past two summers, as she has played the ‘Music On The Mississippi’ lakefront concert series twice in Bemidji. Talk about an amazing talent! Wow!
Also, I was able to collaborate with many amazing musicians from the Bemidji area. Eliza Michaelson came in and completely killed this make-you-cry fiddle part on ‘In This Meantime,’ like it was no big thing. Local legend Kristi Tell Miller brought her mandolin on that same track and just made magic in a couple of takes. Another local wonder is Lance Heddan, who plays saxophone on ‘Ordinary Truth.’ What he was able to accomplish in the studio was nothing short of amazing. It was one of those moments in the studio that will live with me forever, watching Lance play.
Doug Quance is another Bemidji player who plays so many different styles with so many different bands in the area. His drum tracks were outstanding. Gary Broste is a bass player who has played with everyone in the Bemidji area at least twice. He currently plays for Corey Medina and the Brothers, and is simply fantastic. He played upright bass for ‘These Days.’ On that track we were able to land Aaron Jennings, a steel guitar player from Montana.
The final track, ‘Coming Round,’ Ted had the idea to do gang vocals at the very end of the track, and we asked members of our songwriting group: Matthew French, Amanda B. Perry, Marc Severin, and Sarah Morris. We all went to River Rock Studios in Minneapolis and recorded the gang vocals on a spectacular, memorable day last May, 2022. We brought in so many fine players, and I think it elevates and serves the songs so very well.”
A.E.: “You end the record on what feels like an upbeat song with ‘Coming Round.’ Was that on purpose?”
D.T.: “Most definitely. That song is a tribute to my grandfather, Tony Turner. He was one of those people that come to you at exactly the right time in life. He was the right person at the right time for me. He led a big, big life that included a lot of difficult and hell-raising times. He was known for his fighting abilities.
My dad and my uncle tried to wrestle him to the ground on his 60th birthday, and my grandpa was able to beat both of his sons at once in wrestling. By the time I really got to know him as a young teen, he treated me with so much gentleness and grace. He is a huge influence on who I am today. I feel fortunate to have known him.
Throughout all of the heartache and heartbreak that this record contains, I like to think that things will come around. This world is sometimes a lot, and I think the good times do come back around. We just need to persevere and endure. I hope that by persevering and enduring I can someday be a little bit like my grandpa was, or at least make him proud.”
A.E.: “What do you want listeners to take away from this album?”
D.T.: “Connection. I hope that any given listener finds something that resonates. My job as a songwriter is to create in a way that people are able to find space for themselves in what is written and performed. Guy Clark said that a song wasn’t complete until it was played for someone. Songs need listeners to connect and complete them. If something I write connects with a listener, it is a way of both of us knowing we’re not alone, and isn’t that what any of this is for? In ‘Half Past Noon,’ I wrote the lyric, ‘all of this is a love song . . .’ and it’s true. This life. These people. The very sky, water, and trees around us. It’s all a love song from you to me. From me to you.
A.E. “It’s after your show and someone comes up to you who is just now starting to check out the local indie music scene. Who are 3 artists you suggest they check out?”
D.T.: “This is an easy one! First and foremost, I would have them check out Ted Hajnasiewicz, as he is a singer/songwriter who knows exactly what he is about. He writes and performs to engage you in the story — whatever that story is. The way he delivers a lyric, and the way he uses his beautiful voice is a tribute to Willie Nelson, Jeff Tweedy, and Tom Petty. One thing that is super amazing about Ted, is that he covers other local songwriter’s songs. He did that with me. He heard my song, ‘Love Is A Lemon,’ and before you know it, my song is getting heard wherever Ted plays throughout the Twin Cities. His latest cover is of Matthew French’s ‘Leave A Little Love.’ I just think that is such a powerful thing to ask to cover another independent songwriter’s song.
Ted is also super-skilled. Not only did he write and play most of the bass guitar parts on Sweet, Difficult Sounds, he wrote and played a lot of the lead guitar parts, AND sang many of the harmonies. Ted is a quintuple threat, musically, and I respect the hell out of him.
Secondly, I would steer them towards any Sarah Morris show that is available. She quietly works her tail off week in and week out. Sarah’s voice is the show-stopper, but her writing is what draws me in and has solidified my status as a huge fan. It’s open, honest, and gets at that quality that lets each and every set of ears know that we belong as humans, we all make mistakes, and we’re not alone.
I’ve often noted that Sarah writes like a Broadway musical with these longer, intricate phrases. There are theatric leaps and turns in her melodies, yet it always comes back to the fact that we are all human, and as she writes, ‘we belong to each other.’ She’s generous in the way she shares her art and her kindness, her compassion, and her heart. She has taught me so very much about how to do this singer/songwriter thing, as I’ve followed her from the northern part of the state.
There are endless Sarah Morris stories out there of how she went out of her way to be generous in a way that has such impact to the recipients. There is a lay-it-all-out-there honesty in her writing, so much so that you believe every word. Do NOT miss Sarah Morris.
Last, but certainly NOT least, I would steer those who haven’t heard Matthew French to his body of work. Matthew’s writing and delivery are so deceptive. You think you are hearing this really straightforward writing until he has you hooked, then you realize the emotional depth and emotional clarity that he has brought you to. Matthew just captivates you as a listener. He is someone whose songwriting and delivery I admire so very, very much.”
